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 Clean and Unclean Meat

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leedannie
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PostSubject: Clean and Unclean Meat   Tue Oct 12, 2010 11:55 am

supporting to eat unclean meat/ the laws are abolished in new covenant

Mark 7:1-23
Acts 15:19-21
Romans 14:13-23
1 Corinthians 8:8
1 Corinthians 10:25-27
Galatians 3:23-25
Colossians 2:16-17
Hebrews 8:13
Hebrews 13:9

feel free to add more.
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t



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PostSubject: Re: Clean and Unclean Meat   Thu Oct 14, 2010 7:29 am

Since I'm already considering those things unclean, the question of rather to eat or not is not a big deal to me. I'm neutral.

As in 1Cor 8:8, But meat commendeth us not to God: for neither, if we eat, are we the better; neither, if we eat not, are we the worse.

But I'm curious with these questions:

1. If in Acts 15:20, they are to abstrain from food polluted by idols, then why is it that in Romans, 1Cor, etc., there is the "all foods are clean" stance?

2. Acts 15:20 mentioned four things:
- food from idols
- sexual immorality
- things strangled
- things with blood

Why is sexual immorality included if the ten commandments already say "do not commit adultery"? (I came up with an explanation. Ask me if interested.)

3. Acts 15:5 and Acts 15:10. What part of the "law of Moses" is this referring to? Surely the ten commandments should still be kept, right?

But what about:
Lev 19:26-30
- Do not eat any meat with the blood still in it.
- Do not practice divination or sorcery.
- Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard.
- Do not cut your bodies for the dead or put tattoo marks on yourselves. I am the Lord.
- Do not degrade your daughter by making her a prostitute, or the land will turn to
- Observe my Sabbaths and have reverence for my sanctuary. I am the Lord.

Why is it that only the first one is mentioned in Acts 15:20?

-Tony
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leedannie
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PostSubject: Re: Clean and Unclean Meat   Thu Oct 14, 2010 1:23 pm

i believe in deuteronomy or the old convenant so i obey the laws and view the unclean as unclean. this is purely my faith. but i am struggling to find a consensus between the old and new convenant (basically paul's teaching)

paul always emphasized the faith in jesus over observing laws, as if "the inheritance depends on the law, then it no longer depends on a promise, but God in his grace gave it to Abraham through a promise." Galatians 3:18. And paul continues to say "Before this faith came, we were held prisoners by the law, locked up until faith should be revealed. so the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith. Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law." Gal 3:23-25

is paul only referring the "laws" to circumcision and sin offering/ sacrifices, or the whole laws written by moses? i am still looking for an answer...


but for your questions, i dun have an answer but i came up with something.

1.) in 1 corinthians 8, paul stated "...we know that an idol is nothing at all in the world and that there is no God but one... But not everyone knows this. some people are still so accustomed to idols that when they eat such food they think of it as having been sacrificed to an idol, and since their conscience is weak, it is defiled. 8:4-7"
Therefore, "if what i eat cause my brother to fall into sin, i will never eat meat again, so that i will not cause him to fall." 8:13.

paul has the knowledge to eat but not everyone does have this knowledge. if someone is weak, then we shouldn't eat to cause brother to sin. afterall, this is paul's point of view to the church in corinthian.

besides, in Act 15:19, "It is my judgment, therefore, we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God." this is James' point of view upon gentiles. Maybe paul has the knowledge and told corinthian about it, or james didn't have this knowledge? or james has the knowledge but in his own opinion didn't want to make it difficult for the gentiles (assuming the gentiles didn't have this knowledge)?

2.) in Act 15:21 "For Moses has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the synagogues on every Sabbath." this might be the reason why james didn't include all laws of moses in his speech. maybe the 4 things he mentioned were the most common sins in that era among gentiles...!!?? ... and again this is james' point of view.

so what is your understanding? definitely interested.

3.) i have this question as well. as mentioned earlier, i can't tell or distinguish what the yoke is and what laws of moses are abolished. Maybe the yoke is the whole laws of moses which "introduced 430 years later, does not set aside the covenant previously established by God and thus do away with the promise." Gal 3:17. So we don't need to obey moses laws. Instead we should obey the God's standards, which exists since the creation, plus believing in jesus. just my wild guess....

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boyscout



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PostSubject: Re: Clean and Unclean Meat   Sat Oct 16, 2010 11:30 am

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t



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PostSubject: Re: Clean and Unclean Meat   Sat Oct 16, 2010 8:03 pm

I like that explanation.

Each of the 4 (5 including circumcision) things mentioned in Acts 15 were specific laws that aliens living among Israelites had to keep.

Exodus 12:48
Lev 17:8-9
Lev 17:12
Lev 17:13
Lev 18:24

If that explanation is right, this is kind of a big revelation because it seems those 4 laws are like the entry steps for a Gentile to keeping the Law.

Now, with this direct connection to Lev 17, the law to "abstain from food polluted by idols" is really originally about "do not sacrifice food to idols". Back in the OT, they do not have to deal with buying food from the market that may have been sacrificed to idols. That makes Paul's letters (1Cor 8 ) clear. The one who sacrificed to idols has sinned. But to the one who eats, food is just food. 1Cor 8:7 "But not everyone knows this", therefore do not eat if it is a stumbling block to others.

For Lev 18, my view is it is a comprehensive list of all the unlawful sexual acts. This list includes adultery (Lev 18:20), but is not equal to adultery. The reason only adultery is in the 10 Commandments is I think because the other acts are very rare for Israelites. For example, I will never think about committing incest, homosexuality, or bestiality. But adultery, that is something I may be tempted to commit.
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boyscout



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PostSubject: Re: Clean and Unclean Meat   Wed Oct 20, 2010 4:10 pm

The sin of adultery.
Perhaps we should search the Bible to see what other sexual acts and relations were mentioned as sins which are not covered by the aft mentioned verses.
The result might surprise us, although by no means we are encouraged to pursue those we once thought were but are not sins.
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PostSubject: Re: Clean and Unclean Meat   Fri Oct 22, 2010 12:23 pm

this is kind of advence for me.....but is nice to read a little......hope i can come tonight !!
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PostSubject: Re: Clean and Unclean Meat   Fri Oct 22, 2010 1:41 pm

3:31 [hb5] 這 樣 、 我 們 因 信 廢 了 律 法 麼 . 斷 乎 不 是 、 更 是 堅 固 律 法 。

堅 固 律 法 ???? how.....堅 固 = Follow ??
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ahli3259



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PostSubject: Re: Clean and Unclean Meat   Fri Oct 22, 2010 2:29 pm

google dictionary
Greek to english
Rom 3:31
νόμον οὖν καταργοῦμεν διὰ τῆς πίστεως μὴ γένοιτο ἀλλὰ νόμον ἱστῶμεν
lawfully repealed, then, on account of faith lest it be so legally but istomen

English to Chinese
依法撤銷,那麼,考慮到這樣的信念,以免被合法但istomen <---istanomen can't find in google dictionary...



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