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 Rob Skiba vs Zachary Bauer on....the earth

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PostSubject: Rob Skiba vs Zachary Bauer on....the earth   Wed Oct 19, 2016 8:32 pm



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfBRyQxW90E
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PostSubject: Re: Rob Skiba vs Zachary Bauer on....the earth   Sat Mar 11, 2017 5:13 pm

Arguments based on King James Version

Genesis1:14-18
And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so. And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also. And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth, And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.

Genesis 7:11 In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened.

1Chronicles 16:30 Fear before him, all the earth: the world also shall be stable, that it be not moved.

Job 37:18 Hast thou with him spread out the sky, which is strong, and as a molten looking glass?

Psalm 19:1 The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork.

Psalm 104:2 Who coverest thyself with light as with a garment: who stretchest out the heavens like a curtain.

Isaiah 40:22 It is he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof are as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:

Ezekiel 1:1 Now it came to pass in the thirtieth year, in the fourth month, in the fifth day of the month, as I was among the captives by the river of Chebar, that the heavens were opened, and I saw visions of God.
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PostSubject: Re: Rob Skiba vs Zachary Bauer on....the earth   Sat Apr 08, 2017 4:07 pm

Just a thought.

From http://www.hebrew4christians.com/Articles/Hellenism/hellenism.html:
Quote :
Hebrew thinking therefore tended to be more dynamic, more poetic, more dramatic, more "phenomenological" (based on appearances), and more impassioned than that of the ancient Greeks.

We look up; there is indeed a firmament and lights in the firmament for signs.

The earth is indeed firmly established and does not fall from its place.

The sky is indeed spread out as a looking glass and the Most High was indeed the one who did it.
-- This one in particular - you don't use a looking glass to look at things within it, but to see things THROUGH it.
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PostSubject: Re: Rob Skiba vs Zachary Bauer on....the earth   Sat Apr 08, 2017 5:06 pm

I believe it is a matter of whether Genesis is to be understood literally. Just so to be clear,I choose not to open the door for Darwinism.

Genesis 1:6 and 1:17 posted a problem to our concept of space. Both contain the word "firmament" which is on one hand the media separating the water above and the water below and on the other hand contains the sun, moon and the stars. Are these two verses poetic? What is the proper interpretation without prejudice?

The heart of the matter is, what is Genesis chapter 1 supposed to teach it's readers? Are we to believe the world is created in seven literal days? That matters and organisms are created in such order?





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PostSubject: Re: Rob Skiba vs Zachary Bauer on....the earth   Fri Apr 14, 2017 11:25 pm

The following is my opinion. And it's apart from the flat/round debate because my view is the bible does not give a clear account of the implementation details.

Reading Genesis 1 without prejudice, there is only one firmament.

Verse 7-8:
And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.
And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.

Heaven is the firmament.

In verse 14, it is the same firmament of heaven.

Without prejudice, the heavens extend high beneath our reach just as the oceans ("the deep") are deep beyond our reach.

Neh 9:6
Thou, even thou, art LORD alone; thou hast made heaven, the heaven of heavens, with all their host, the earth, and all things that are therein, the seas, and all that is therein, and thou preservest them all; and the host of heaven worshippeth thee.
- without prejudice, I would assume the writer is depicting the host (i.e. the stars) as belonging in the heaven of heavens.

Ps 68:33
To him that rideth upon the heavens of heavens, which were of old; lo, he doth send out his voice, and that a mighty voice.
- also gives an image of the heavens extending far above

What I'm saying with these points is - those drawings with the sun and moon in a glass dome ceiling - I don't see that in the bible and I also don't trust scholars that either (in case of jews) rejected the messiah or (in case of early christians) also have inaccurate paintings of the messiah.
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PostSubject: Re: Rob Skiba vs Zachary Bauer on....the earth   Sat Apr 15, 2017 12:55 pm

If there's only one firmament and the firmament is heaven, what is heaven of heavens in the bible?

Clouds are in the heaven, not above the heaven so what is the water above the heaven?

Genesis 7:11 In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, in the second month, on the seventeenth day of the month, on the same day all the fountains of the great deep burst open, and the floodgates of the sky were opened.
Is it merely a poetic way to describe flooding and raining? And that flooding actually came after raining?

What does the opening of heaven/heavens mean cf Ezekiel1:1, Matthew 3:16, John 1:51, Revelation 19:11? Do these verses describe visions instead of actual events?




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PostSubject: Re: Rob Skiba vs Zachary Bauer on....the earth   Sat Apr 15, 2017 11:38 pm

My interpretations are very simplistic. Here it is, whether you like it or not. If you have something better, I would like to hear it but I would like to see you apply the same level of skepticism towards it.

Heaven of heavens is just heaven high above.

Water above the heaven can be water vapour or clouds. Just as in Gen 1:7-8, heaven is both the firmament (that which divides the water) and the "sky", so the clouds can be said to be in heaven or above heaven. I do not think it is meant to be technical.

Fountains of the great deep, floodgates of the sky - That is what happened. It is described in the best way for us to understand. Fountains burst open - allows us to see the strong waves roaring in. Floodgates of the sky - the rain poured down like a flood. Define literal because there are indeed floodgates in the sky but they do not literally look like floodgates made by humans.

Opening of heavens - I have always envisioned that as a hole in heaven and great light shining through.
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PostSubject: Re: Rob Skiba vs Zachary Bauer on....the earth   Sun Apr 16, 2017 9:20 am

Like I said, I am told that Hebrew is a very precise language.

I would imagine above and within are two entirely different words.

I would imagine opening of something always mean opening of something - be it floodgate or some holes in heaven.

When science is applied, all my imaginations and that of early believers evaporated.

And here comes the retards who think they can hold true to the Bible to speak against science. Not a chance.

Adding on 4/17:

Let's say heliocentrism is established dogma and doctrine in a religion. Let's say those geocentrists and flatearthers are cults.
Let's say I'm interested in the religion but I have many questions regarding it's dogma and doctrine.
The cults are providing many so called facts and explanations against such.
The leaders and believers of the religion are telling me they are wrong and I shouldn't be listening to them because they are interpreting incorrectly.
I ask what's wrong with this and that. They say "use wise judgments". Well, I'm stupid and that's why I asked.
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