Our Fellowship Forum

Welcome to Our Fellowship Forum!
 
HomeGalleryRegisterLog in

Share | 
 

 Acts 27:9 about fasting

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
AuthorMessage
boyscout



Number of posts : 345
Age : 105
Location : the 3rd rock
Registration date : 2009-03-10

PostSubject: Acts 27:9 about fasting   Sat Oct 22, 2016 7:44 am

If one does a google search on "Acts 27:9 must Christians fast?", it will result in many pro-fast articles from all walks of Christians including those who do not observe the weekly Sabbath and the feasts.
The good news is, they finally have something in agreement.
The bad news, however, is that they totally missed the target <----might be offensive but the truth does sometimes hurt.

Acts 27:9 reads: Much time had been lost, and sailing had already become dangerous because by now it was after the Fast*. So Paul warned them.
*NIV footnote: that is, the day of atonement.

Now questions:
1. Does "the Fast" in Acts 27:9 refer to "the day of atonement"?
2. Does the verse in question suggest that those in presence fasted?
3. Does this verse in context promote fasting?
4. Does the Torah use "the Fast" to refer to the day of atonement?
5. What does "atonement" mean and what did Leviticus 16 and 23 say regarding such? Was atonement made by fasting?
You may read my other topic "day of atonement realized".



Back to top Go down
View user profile
t



Number of posts : 135
Age : 32
Location : Bellevue, WA
Registration date : 2009-03-11

PostSubject: Re: Acts 27:9 about fasting   Sat Oct 29, 2016 4:57 pm

In v9, it is said "sailing was now dangerous, because the fast was now already past". v12 shows this is before winter. Since the timing is in the fall and we only know of one day when people would fast, it only makes sense to be the day of atonement.

What I gather from this is that Paul did fast and the author also seems to acknowledge the day of atonement to commonly be known as "the fast".

Whether or not to fast is between each person and YHWH. I have not found a reason to not fast. If you seek to keep His commandments because you want to love Him then it's not legalism.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
boyscout



Number of posts : 345
Age : 105
Location : the 3rd rock
Registration date : 2009-03-10

PostSubject: Re: Acts 27:9 about fasting   Sat Oct 29, 2016 7:06 pm

I always say fasting is an (re)action of man to the commandment of "afflicting your soul" and there's nothing wrong with calling the day of atonement "the fast" when many had chosen to fast on that particular day.

However, history (the old testament part of the bible) has shown that fasting did not lead to salvation but rather
gave a superficial sense of security. Even the Messiah gave an example of such. Thus one must weigh what the right thing to do is.

Did Paul fast on that day in the context? If he did, was it because he obey the law? If yes then why was he so against circumcision which was also required in the law? If not then what is the purpose of fasting?

You are right in saying whether or not to fast is between each person and Yahweh. But for one's own sins when they have been covered by the blood of the Messiah? No I'm strongly against that.

The Messiah said: If anyone loves me, he will obey my teaching. My father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him.
He also said "How can the guests of the bridegroom mourn while he is with them?" in answering the question about fasting.
Does the Messiah dwell in us?
What would make the Messiah dwell in us?






Back to top Go down
View user profile
t



Number of posts : 135
Age : 32
Location : Bellevue, WA
Registration date : 2009-03-11

PostSubject: Re: Acts 27:9 about fasting   Mon Oct 31, 2016 6:16 pm

I gave my view on the day of atonement on the other thread.

I will just comment on a couple of things here.

- In my view, it is more likely than not that Paul did fast. This is just based on how that verse is written.

- Personally I do not think Paul was against circumcision. I don't think I should discuss this without studying more, but basically my view is that Paul was only against giving into the Pharisees' demands to have Gentiles circumcised in order to be saved (Acts 15:1). That would be of outward appearance and of no effect. This does not mean gentiles cannot decide to circumcise themselves (of their own will) after they have circumcised their hearts and have learned the law of Moses.

- Regarding "How can the guests of the bridegroom mourn while he is with them?", I'm not sure but here is what came to mind:
-- It's not about the day of atonement. Luke 5:33 in particular has "the disciples of John fast often".
-- Yeshua the bridegroom did say that he needs to go away to prepare a place for the bride (John 14:3, 28). Has v23 been fully realized? In context, perhaps not. We know that the marriage supper has not occurred yet. Rev 19:9 "Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb." Halleluyah!
-- Yeshua's first coming was probably one fulfillment of the feast of tabernacles, where he did physically come and dwell among his people. "The Word was made flesh, and tabernacled among us". If the Messiah is already tabernacling in us and thus we should not fast, this would also apply to the feast of tabernacles. But we know that there is yet a fulfillment to the feast of tabernacles -- Rev 21:3.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
boyscout



Number of posts : 345
Age : 105
Location : the 3rd rock
Registration date : 2009-03-10

PostSubject: Re: Acts 27:9 about fasting   Tue Nov 01, 2016 5:31 pm

I was dealing with fasting in general. The disciple of John and the Pharisees fasted often and that would include fasting on the day of atonement.
Fasting is a way of denying oneself. I would like to hear if you have a better explanation of why one's doing it.

The Messiah atoned our sins once and for all and He dwells in those who obey His commandments, is He not?

He dwells in those who obey His commandments whether or not they fast.

When He said He went to prepare a place for the believers, does it mean He has to physically and/or spiritually leave them and physically and/or spiritually prepare that place?

The Word was made flesh, and tabernacled among us: What does it mean? Is He not spiritually in us? If so why do we have to physically fast?

I'm not challenging the act of fasting. Simply I would like to have a clear picture of your view.

You know well that I fasted every so often because of the troubles I caused.



Back to top Go down
View user profile
t



Number of posts : 135
Age : 32
Location : Bellevue, WA
Registration date : 2009-03-11

PostSubject: Re: Acts 27:9 about fasting   Sat Nov 19, 2016 5:56 am

I do not know if I'm right but I will try to share my view.

- not fasting while the groom is with them - that does not mean they didn't fast on the day of atonement. I'd think that they would fast on the day of atonement as they do every year

- John 14-15 talks about Yeshua and the father dwelling in those who love him. To what capacity and is that the same as when Yeshua was physically with them and when he returns to dwell with his people permanently? I don't know. My opinion is it's not the same. I believe when Yeshua became flesh and when he returns again are the two fulfillments of feast of tabernacles. We have his word in us. We may have his holy spirit with us. Is he already dwelling in his people or is it a promise? I don't know. Maybe you can share what you think.

- regarding Yeshua going away to make room for his people. I'm told this is fulfillment of Israel's marriage customs where the groom goes to his father's place and has to build a house for himself and the bride. He can't go to the bride until he is done and the bride doesn't know the day or the hour that he will come to take her and have the marriage supper. If this is true, then based on this type, Yeshua is separate from the bride until he comes and holds the marriage supper. I do kind of buy into this view and think "can't fast while groom is with them" does not apply to the present.



Back to top Go down
View user profile
boyscout



Number of posts : 345
Age : 105
Location : the 3rd rock
Registration date : 2009-03-10

PostSubject: Re: Acts 27:9 about fasting   Sat Nov 19, 2016 4:50 pm

My last argument was, should believers fast physically when the Messiah is spiritually with them?
For sure the Messiah is not physically with believers now - and - He will not physically, the way we understand it, be with believers in the new heavens and new earth. It will be a whole new dimension.

John 14-15 is indeed a promise which is, together with the promises in the verses I'm providing below, to realize if believers do as He commanded in this present world.

The following additional verses are examples to proof the Messiah, and for that matter the Father and the Holy Spirit, is (are) with believers:
Matthew 24:20 ...and teach them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.
2 Corinthians 13:5 Examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith; test yourselves. Do you not realize that Christ Jesus is in you - unless, of course, you fail the test?
Ephesians 2:6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus.
1 John 3:24 Those who obey his commands live in Him, and He is them. And this is how we know that He lives in us: We know it by the Spirit He gave us.

If the mentioning of "the Fast" proved Paul fasted according to the law (I will address the law on another topic) and that believers are to follow, does the mentioning of Passover and unleavened bread in 1 Corinthians 5:7-8 require believers to slaughter a lamb, put its blood on the doorframes and to follow other details according to the law too?
Back to top Go down
View user profile
t



Number of posts : 135
Age : 32
Location : Bellevue, WA
Registration date : 2009-03-11

PostSubject: Re: Acts 27:9 about fasting   Sat Nov 26, 2016 3:58 am

In my opinion, no, because I believe the slaughtering of the passover lamb has been fulfilled (as stated in 1 Cor) while the day of atonement has not. I have explained my reasons for thinking so.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
boyscout



Number of posts : 345
Age : 105
Location : the 3rd rock
Registration date : 2009-03-10

PostSubject: Re: Acts 27:9 about fasting   Sat Dec 03, 2016 4:41 pm

But it was an everlasting ordinance to sacrifice a lamb on the Passover and eat unleavened bread for the next 7 days.
So no lamb sacrifice but eat unleavened bread for the next 7 days? Was the Passover only half realized?
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: Acts 27:9 about fasting   

Back to top Go down
 
Acts 27:9 about fasting
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 1 of 1
 Similar topics
-
» What the recommended and significant acts of worship in Ramadan?
» Lecture : THE FASTING & THE FURIOUS !!!! 17th-08- GTA area!!!
» Chapter 01-Fasting
» Fasting before mediumship?
» Fasting - A History Dr Jason Fung

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Our Fellowship Forum :: Our Fellowship :: Bible Discussion-
Jump to: